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Deal with toxic manager when you can't quit



The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InHow to write an appealing internship offer?How to handle a manager constantly demotivating youHow can I get unbiased and objective feedback when my manager is a friend of mine?Manager got offended with my correction. How to deal with him?Let manager know I don't fault him for recruiter's mistakes and am sorry about being rudeNew line manager coming in aggressiveWhat to tell the senior staff about dietary restrictions of my team, for a welcome party?How to handle deteriorating situation with manager?New manager is a jerk - is it OK to quit without providing a reason?Should I call out a toxic manager by name on Glassdoor?



.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;








8















At my first job, I had the bad luck to get a manager that was, quite literally toxic.



This was to the point of him driving most of the team to quit.
In the three month I was there, he drove 5 people to quit (in a team composed of 12 persons), and was growing close to drive the rest of the team to quit.



To give a perspective of why he was toxic :



  • Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour" or "That was really easy, don't be too proud of yourself"

  • Constantly failing to meet deadlines, which resulted in everyone else (not him) to stay overtime to try and makes things right (We once had to wait 3 week, for a vital piece of information, and when he delivered it to us, we were one week behind the deadline).

  • Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay.

Now at the time I was lucky enough to have the possibility to leave without too much consequences. But a colleague there was not so lucky, as he needed this job to sustain his family.



This made me wonder, if there exists any method to, at the very least, mitigate the stress induced by this kind of manager ? When quitting is not an option, and you have to stick with the job ?



As suggested a little more precision on the situation :



This happened in France, in a region where the supply of software developer is far higher than the demand, and leaving your job can lead to several months of job hunting.



In France when you quit, it is harder to get monetary compensation than if you were let go.



Also, there was only two people above this manager, there had already been complaints made, but they did not do anything, because he had way too much responsibilities, and the company was basically tied to him, for better or for worse.










share|improve this question



















  • 2





    @gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago











  • How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

    – Kozaky
    3 hours ago











  • @Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

    – Xander
    3 hours ago






  • 3





    So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

    – only_pro
    52 mins ago

















8















At my first job, I had the bad luck to get a manager that was, quite literally toxic.



This was to the point of him driving most of the team to quit.
In the three month I was there, he drove 5 people to quit (in a team composed of 12 persons), and was growing close to drive the rest of the team to quit.



To give a perspective of why he was toxic :



  • Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour" or "That was really easy, don't be too proud of yourself"

  • Constantly failing to meet deadlines, which resulted in everyone else (not him) to stay overtime to try and makes things right (We once had to wait 3 week, for a vital piece of information, and when he delivered it to us, we were one week behind the deadline).

  • Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay.

Now at the time I was lucky enough to have the possibility to leave without too much consequences. But a colleague there was not so lucky, as he needed this job to sustain his family.



This made me wonder, if there exists any method to, at the very least, mitigate the stress induced by this kind of manager ? When quitting is not an option, and you have to stick with the job ?



As suggested a little more precision on the situation :



This happened in France, in a region where the supply of software developer is far higher than the demand, and leaving your job can lead to several months of job hunting.



In France when you quit, it is harder to get monetary compensation than if you were let go.



Also, there was only two people above this manager, there had already been complaints made, but they did not do anything, because he had way too much responsibilities, and the company was basically tied to him, for better or for worse.










share|improve this question



















  • 2





    @gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago











  • How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

    – Kozaky
    3 hours ago











  • @Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

    – Xander
    3 hours ago






  • 3





    So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

    – only_pro
    52 mins ago













8












8








8








At my first job, I had the bad luck to get a manager that was, quite literally toxic.



This was to the point of him driving most of the team to quit.
In the three month I was there, he drove 5 people to quit (in a team composed of 12 persons), and was growing close to drive the rest of the team to quit.



To give a perspective of why he was toxic :



  • Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour" or "That was really easy, don't be too proud of yourself"

  • Constantly failing to meet deadlines, which resulted in everyone else (not him) to stay overtime to try and makes things right (We once had to wait 3 week, for a vital piece of information, and when he delivered it to us, we were one week behind the deadline).

  • Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay.

Now at the time I was lucky enough to have the possibility to leave without too much consequences. But a colleague there was not so lucky, as he needed this job to sustain his family.



This made me wonder, if there exists any method to, at the very least, mitigate the stress induced by this kind of manager ? When quitting is not an option, and you have to stick with the job ?



As suggested a little more precision on the situation :



This happened in France, in a region where the supply of software developer is far higher than the demand, and leaving your job can lead to several months of job hunting.



In France when you quit, it is harder to get monetary compensation than if you were let go.



Also, there was only two people above this manager, there had already been complaints made, but they did not do anything, because he had way too much responsibilities, and the company was basically tied to him, for better or for worse.










share|improve this question
















At my first job, I had the bad luck to get a manager that was, quite literally toxic.



This was to the point of him driving most of the team to quit.
In the three month I was there, he drove 5 people to quit (in a team composed of 12 persons), and was growing close to drive the rest of the team to quit.



To give a perspective of why he was toxic :



  • Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour" or "That was really easy, don't be too proud of yourself"

  • Constantly failing to meet deadlines, which resulted in everyone else (not him) to stay overtime to try and makes things right (We once had to wait 3 week, for a vital piece of information, and when he delivered it to us, we were one week behind the deadline).

  • Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay.

Now at the time I was lucky enough to have the possibility to leave without too much consequences. But a colleague there was not so lucky, as he needed this job to sustain his family.



This made me wonder, if there exists any method to, at the very least, mitigate the stress induced by this kind of manager ? When quitting is not an option, and you have to stick with the job ?



As suggested a little more precision on the situation :



This happened in France, in a region where the supply of software developer is far higher than the demand, and leaving your job can lead to several months of job hunting.



In France when you quit, it is harder to get monetary compensation than if you were let go.



Also, there was only two people above this manager, there had already been complaints made, but they did not do anything, because he had way too much responsibilities, and the company was basically tied to him, for better or for worse.







manager stress france






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 2 hours ago









Chris E

41.3k24131169




41.3k24131169










asked 4 hours ago









user3399user3399

1765




1765







  • 2





    @gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago











  • How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

    – Kozaky
    3 hours ago











  • @Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

    – Xander
    3 hours ago






  • 3





    So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

    – only_pro
    52 mins ago












  • 2





    @gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago











  • How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

    – Kozaky
    3 hours ago











  • @Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

    – Xander
    3 hours ago






  • 3





    So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

    – only_pro
    52 mins ago







2




2





@gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

– user3399
3 hours ago





@gnasher729 I wish, things would have been much better if it was.

– user3399
3 hours ago













How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

– Kozaky
3 hours ago





How big is the company? Who would be your go-to if you and your colleagues had to make a formal complaint about the manager's behaviour?

– Kozaky
3 hours ago













@Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

– user3399
3 hours ago





@Kozaky 20 people at most, the go to would be nobody, as the the only people above him basically left everything up to him. He managed the commercial pole, support pole, developement pole, and was also responsible for recruiting and managing new people. And anytime the leaders had to take a decision that impacted the company, they refered to him before doing so.

– user3399
3 hours ago




1




1





Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

– Xander
3 hours ago





Did the idea of actually finding a job before quitting pass his mind? Or isn't that allowed in France? I mean he can jobhunt for months and quit when he has a job and not before. It's a small sacrifice to rid himself of the manager.

– Xander
3 hours ago




3




3





So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

– only_pro
52 mins ago





So then, not "quite literally" toxic but rather figuratively toxic. Got it.

– only_pro
52 mins ago










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















15














First of all, quitting is always an option. What would your colleague do if the company suddenly closed its doors? (This happens, and the employees are usually the last to see it coming).



Your colleague needs to stop making excuses and start job hunting for real. It may take a long time, but there are better jobs and non-toxic managers out there.



In the meantime, there are a couple of things your colleague can do:




Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour"




  • Remember that this person is toxic and whatever comes out of their mouth is not relevant or meaningful. Stop caring about this manager's opinion.


Constantly failing to meet deadlines




  • Keep a written log of what was promised, when, and by whom. When anything happens, log that as well (what, when, by whom). It's a major pain in the rear to do, but when the grand boss comes around looking for necks to choke it will not only protect you, it may shine some unwanted light on the toxic manager.


Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay




  • Same as above - keep a log about what was earned, paid, etc. and remember that the babbling of fools is best ignored as much as possible.

  • If the colleague is paid hourly, then not receiving overtime pay is something to take up with HR or the union, if there is one. If the colleague is salaried and this is "comp time", then the right answer might be to stop working the overtime to begin with (so there's nothing to comp)





share|improve this answer


















  • 3





    If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago







  • 1





    That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago











  • Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

    – Ister
    27 mins ago



















9














To reduce the stress: Stop caring. After 8 hours work a day, stop working. If the manager makes it hard to leave, stop working and get overtime pay without working. If he says “I could have done that in an hour” you say “of course you could” so he doesn’t see you getting upset (because that’s what he wants) while thinking to yourself what you actually think of him. Same if he says “that was really easy”, you say “absolutely, that was really easy, you could have done that in an hour”.



He knows what he is, and you know what he is, so make it clear without saying anything bad that you know and you don’t care. It’s only stress if you care.






share|improve this answer


















  • 2





    I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

    – Strader
    3 hours ago






  • 2





    The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

    – busman
    2 hours ago



















2














The immature American way to deal with toxic people who you can't remove from your life, assuming you've already had a sit down with them and explained why their behavior is unacceptable, is to cut them down back.



For example, "I could have done that in an hour" should be answered with something like "You sure you're sober?" or "I'd like to see you try".



Refusing to pay for work should be met with "No money, no honey" and followed up by you not showing up to work the next day for whatever reason - probably sick time, it honestly doesn't matter if it gets approved or not because you're sending a message.



That piece of information you didn't get that put the entire team behind schedule should be something that the manager is never allowed to forget. Bring it up every time it might be relevant.



This is the wrong thing to do, but if you can't quit and really want things to work out, you're going to have to discipline your manager.



The professional thing to do is to document this behavior, send it to your managers superiors even though you know they won't do anything, and find another job. Look for a job while you still have one and then stop working with the toxic manager as soon as you get a new job. People like this are going to have a much bigger impact on your career than they have any right to if you keep working for them.






share|improve this answer























  • Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

    – Ister
    25 mins ago











  • Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

    – donjuedo
    18 mins ago











  • @donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

    – Steve
    4 mins ago











  • @Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

    – Steve
    1 min ago











  • @Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

    – donjuedo
    42 secs ago












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3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes








3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes









15














First of all, quitting is always an option. What would your colleague do if the company suddenly closed its doors? (This happens, and the employees are usually the last to see it coming).



Your colleague needs to stop making excuses and start job hunting for real. It may take a long time, but there are better jobs and non-toxic managers out there.



In the meantime, there are a couple of things your colleague can do:




Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour"




  • Remember that this person is toxic and whatever comes out of their mouth is not relevant or meaningful. Stop caring about this manager's opinion.


Constantly failing to meet deadlines




  • Keep a written log of what was promised, when, and by whom. When anything happens, log that as well (what, when, by whom). It's a major pain in the rear to do, but when the grand boss comes around looking for necks to choke it will not only protect you, it may shine some unwanted light on the toxic manager.


Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay




  • Same as above - keep a log about what was earned, paid, etc. and remember that the babbling of fools is best ignored as much as possible.

  • If the colleague is paid hourly, then not receiving overtime pay is something to take up with HR or the union, if there is one. If the colleague is salaried and this is "comp time", then the right answer might be to stop working the overtime to begin with (so there's nothing to comp)





share|improve this answer


















  • 3





    If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago







  • 1





    That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago











  • Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

    – Ister
    27 mins ago
















15














First of all, quitting is always an option. What would your colleague do if the company suddenly closed its doors? (This happens, and the employees are usually the last to see it coming).



Your colleague needs to stop making excuses and start job hunting for real. It may take a long time, but there are better jobs and non-toxic managers out there.



In the meantime, there are a couple of things your colleague can do:




Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour"




  • Remember that this person is toxic and whatever comes out of their mouth is not relevant or meaningful. Stop caring about this manager's opinion.


Constantly failing to meet deadlines




  • Keep a written log of what was promised, when, and by whom. When anything happens, log that as well (what, when, by whom). It's a major pain in the rear to do, but when the grand boss comes around looking for necks to choke it will not only protect you, it may shine some unwanted light on the toxic manager.


Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay




  • Same as above - keep a log about what was earned, paid, etc. and remember that the babbling of fools is best ignored as much as possible.

  • If the colleague is paid hourly, then not receiving overtime pay is something to take up with HR or the union, if there is one. If the colleague is salaried and this is "comp time", then the right answer might be to stop working the overtime to begin with (so there's nothing to comp)





share|improve this answer


















  • 3





    If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago







  • 1





    That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago











  • Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

    – Ister
    27 mins ago














15












15








15







First of all, quitting is always an option. What would your colleague do if the company suddenly closed its doors? (This happens, and the employees are usually the last to see it coming).



Your colleague needs to stop making excuses and start job hunting for real. It may take a long time, but there are better jobs and non-toxic managers out there.



In the meantime, there are a couple of things your colleague can do:




Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour"




  • Remember that this person is toxic and whatever comes out of their mouth is not relevant or meaningful. Stop caring about this manager's opinion.


Constantly failing to meet deadlines




  • Keep a written log of what was promised, when, and by whom. When anything happens, log that as well (what, when, by whom). It's a major pain in the rear to do, but when the grand boss comes around looking for necks to choke it will not only protect you, it may shine some unwanted light on the toxic manager.


Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay




  • Same as above - keep a log about what was earned, paid, etc. and remember that the babbling of fools is best ignored as much as possible.

  • If the colleague is paid hourly, then not receiving overtime pay is something to take up with HR or the union, if there is one. If the colleague is salaried and this is "comp time", then the right answer might be to stop working the overtime to begin with (so there's nothing to comp)





share|improve this answer













First of all, quitting is always an option. What would your colleague do if the company suddenly closed its doors? (This happens, and the employees are usually the last to see it coming).



Your colleague needs to stop making excuses and start job hunting for real. It may take a long time, but there are better jobs and non-toxic managers out there.



In the meantime, there are a couple of things your colleague can do:




Constantly undermining every one's work by saying thing like "I could have done it in one hour"




  • Remember that this person is toxic and whatever comes out of their mouth is not relevant or meaningful. Stop caring about this manager's opinion.


Constantly failing to meet deadlines




  • Keep a written log of what was promised, when, and by whom. When anything happens, log that as well (what, when, by whom). It's a major pain in the rear to do, but when the grand boss comes around looking for necks to choke it will not only protect you, it may shine some unwanted light on the toxic manager.


Berating the team for using their rights, such as overtime pay




  • Same as above - keep a log about what was earned, paid, etc. and remember that the babbling of fools is best ignored as much as possible.

  • If the colleague is paid hourly, then not receiving overtime pay is something to take up with HR or the union, if there is one. If the colleague is salaried and this is "comp time", then the right answer might be to stop working the overtime to begin with (so there's nothing to comp)






share|improve this answer












share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer










answered 3 hours ago









Dan PichelmanDan Pichelman

28.7k147794




28.7k147794







  • 3





    If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago







  • 1





    That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago











  • Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

    – Ister
    27 mins ago













  • 3





    If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

    – user3399
    3 hours ago







  • 1





    That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago






  • 1





    Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

    – Dan Pichelman
    3 hours ago











  • Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

    – Ister
    27 mins ago








3




3





If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

– user3399
3 hours ago






If the company closed its door, this employee would receive monetary compensation (this happens in france) it would not be a lot, but enough to sustain his family. If he had quit, he would not have received any kind of money before a minimum of 3 month. He was actively looking, but it was in a region where the software development supply was far, far higher than the demand. Moving was not an option for them.

– user3399
3 hours ago





1




1





That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

– Dan Pichelman
3 hours ago





That's good to know. In the US, it's possible for the company to close and the employees are suddenly out of work with no warning and no compensation.

– Dan Pichelman
3 hours ago




1




1





Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

– Dan Pichelman
3 hours ago





Perhaps the colleague can find remote work? In software development it's not always necessary to be in the same room to produce code.

– Dan Pichelman
3 hours ago













Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

– Ister
27 mins ago






Also all details and proofs of the overtime work can later be used to eventually receive compensation once your colleague has found a new job and left the old one. Just consult your local authority regarding labour.

– Ister
27 mins ago














9














To reduce the stress: Stop caring. After 8 hours work a day, stop working. If the manager makes it hard to leave, stop working and get overtime pay without working. If he says “I could have done that in an hour” you say “of course you could” so he doesn’t see you getting upset (because that’s what he wants) while thinking to yourself what you actually think of him. Same if he says “that was really easy”, you say “absolutely, that was really easy, you could have done that in an hour”.



He knows what he is, and you know what he is, so make it clear without saying anything bad that you know and you don’t care. It’s only stress if you care.






share|improve this answer


















  • 2





    I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

    – Strader
    3 hours ago






  • 2





    The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

    – busman
    2 hours ago
















9














To reduce the stress: Stop caring. After 8 hours work a day, stop working. If the manager makes it hard to leave, stop working and get overtime pay without working. If he says “I could have done that in an hour” you say “of course you could” so he doesn’t see you getting upset (because that’s what he wants) while thinking to yourself what you actually think of him. Same if he says “that was really easy”, you say “absolutely, that was really easy, you could have done that in an hour”.



He knows what he is, and you know what he is, so make it clear without saying anything bad that you know and you don’t care. It’s only stress if you care.






share|improve this answer


















  • 2





    I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

    – Strader
    3 hours ago






  • 2





    The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

    – busman
    2 hours ago














9












9








9







To reduce the stress: Stop caring. After 8 hours work a day, stop working. If the manager makes it hard to leave, stop working and get overtime pay without working. If he says “I could have done that in an hour” you say “of course you could” so he doesn’t see you getting upset (because that’s what he wants) while thinking to yourself what you actually think of him. Same if he says “that was really easy”, you say “absolutely, that was really easy, you could have done that in an hour”.



He knows what he is, and you know what he is, so make it clear without saying anything bad that you know and you don’t care. It’s only stress if you care.






share|improve this answer













To reduce the stress: Stop caring. After 8 hours work a day, stop working. If the manager makes it hard to leave, stop working and get overtime pay without working. If he says “I could have done that in an hour” you say “of course you could” so he doesn’t see you getting upset (because that’s what he wants) while thinking to yourself what you actually think of him. Same if he says “that was really easy”, you say “absolutely, that was really easy, you could have done that in an hour”.



He knows what he is, and you know what he is, so make it clear without saying anything bad that you know and you don’t care. It’s only stress if you care.







share|improve this answer












share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer










answered 3 hours ago









gnasher729gnasher729

91.5k41162286




91.5k41162286







  • 2





    I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

    – Strader
    3 hours ago






  • 2





    The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

    – busman
    2 hours ago













  • 2





    I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

    – Strader
    3 hours ago






  • 2





    The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

    – busman
    2 hours ago








2




2





I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

– Strader
3 hours ago





I disagree, being belittled on regular basis is stressful for any person.

– Strader
3 hours ago




2




2





The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

– busman
2 hours ago






The best answer to "I could have done that in an hour" is "then you don't need me to do it". If he follows that by suggesting that you should quit if you think so then the answer should be "I don't think so, but if you do, you know what to do". This, of course, does not help in the stress mitigation issue, but at least puts limits into his insolence and allows to move forward onto the inevitable outcome.

– busman
2 hours ago












2














The immature American way to deal with toxic people who you can't remove from your life, assuming you've already had a sit down with them and explained why their behavior is unacceptable, is to cut them down back.



For example, "I could have done that in an hour" should be answered with something like "You sure you're sober?" or "I'd like to see you try".



Refusing to pay for work should be met with "No money, no honey" and followed up by you not showing up to work the next day for whatever reason - probably sick time, it honestly doesn't matter if it gets approved or not because you're sending a message.



That piece of information you didn't get that put the entire team behind schedule should be something that the manager is never allowed to forget. Bring it up every time it might be relevant.



This is the wrong thing to do, but if you can't quit and really want things to work out, you're going to have to discipline your manager.



The professional thing to do is to document this behavior, send it to your managers superiors even though you know they won't do anything, and find another job. Look for a job while you still have one and then stop working with the toxic manager as soon as you get a new job. People like this are going to have a much bigger impact on your career than they have any right to if you keep working for them.






share|improve this answer























  • Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

    – Ister
    25 mins ago











  • Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

    – donjuedo
    18 mins ago











  • @donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

    – Steve
    4 mins ago











  • @Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

    – Steve
    1 min ago











  • @Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

    – donjuedo
    42 secs ago
















2














The immature American way to deal with toxic people who you can't remove from your life, assuming you've already had a sit down with them and explained why their behavior is unacceptable, is to cut them down back.



For example, "I could have done that in an hour" should be answered with something like "You sure you're sober?" or "I'd like to see you try".



Refusing to pay for work should be met with "No money, no honey" and followed up by you not showing up to work the next day for whatever reason - probably sick time, it honestly doesn't matter if it gets approved or not because you're sending a message.



That piece of information you didn't get that put the entire team behind schedule should be something that the manager is never allowed to forget. Bring it up every time it might be relevant.



This is the wrong thing to do, but if you can't quit and really want things to work out, you're going to have to discipline your manager.



The professional thing to do is to document this behavior, send it to your managers superiors even though you know they won't do anything, and find another job. Look for a job while you still have one and then stop working with the toxic manager as soon as you get a new job. People like this are going to have a much bigger impact on your career than they have any right to if you keep working for them.






share|improve this answer























  • Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

    – Ister
    25 mins ago











  • Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

    – donjuedo
    18 mins ago











  • @donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

    – Steve
    4 mins ago











  • @Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

    – Steve
    1 min ago











  • @Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

    – donjuedo
    42 secs ago














2












2








2







The immature American way to deal with toxic people who you can't remove from your life, assuming you've already had a sit down with them and explained why their behavior is unacceptable, is to cut them down back.



For example, "I could have done that in an hour" should be answered with something like "You sure you're sober?" or "I'd like to see you try".



Refusing to pay for work should be met with "No money, no honey" and followed up by you not showing up to work the next day for whatever reason - probably sick time, it honestly doesn't matter if it gets approved or not because you're sending a message.



That piece of information you didn't get that put the entire team behind schedule should be something that the manager is never allowed to forget. Bring it up every time it might be relevant.



This is the wrong thing to do, but if you can't quit and really want things to work out, you're going to have to discipline your manager.



The professional thing to do is to document this behavior, send it to your managers superiors even though you know they won't do anything, and find another job. Look for a job while you still have one and then stop working with the toxic manager as soon as you get a new job. People like this are going to have a much bigger impact on your career than they have any right to if you keep working for them.






share|improve this answer













The immature American way to deal with toxic people who you can't remove from your life, assuming you've already had a sit down with them and explained why their behavior is unacceptable, is to cut them down back.



For example, "I could have done that in an hour" should be answered with something like "You sure you're sober?" or "I'd like to see you try".



Refusing to pay for work should be met with "No money, no honey" and followed up by you not showing up to work the next day for whatever reason - probably sick time, it honestly doesn't matter if it gets approved or not because you're sending a message.



That piece of information you didn't get that put the entire team behind schedule should be something that the manager is never allowed to forget. Bring it up every time it might be relevant.



This is the wrong thing to do, but if you can't quit and really want things to work out, you're going to have to discipline your manager.



The professional thing to do is to document this behavior, send it to your managers superiors even though you know they won't do anything, and find another job. Look for a job while you still have one and then stop working with the toxic manager as soon as you get a new job. People like this are going to have a much bigger impact on your career than they have any right to if you keep working for them.







share|improve this answer












share|improve this answer



share|improve this answer










answered 59 mins ago









SteveSteve

3,467722




3,467722












  • Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

    – Ister
    25 mins ago











  • Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

    – donjuedo
    18 mins ago











  • @donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

    – Steve
    4 mins ago











  • @Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

    – Steve
    1 min ago











  • @Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

    – donjuedo
    42 secs ago


















  • Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

    – Ister
    25 mins ago











  • Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

    – donjuedo
    18 mins ago











  • @donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

    – Steve
    4 mins ago











  • @Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

    – Steve
    1 min ago











  • @Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

    – donjuedo
    42 secs ago

















Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

– Ister
25 mins ago





Unfortunately this (especially not showing up) might lead to negative consequences up to firing the employee on their fault (which would probably also leave them with no compensation).

– Ister
25 mins ago













Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

– donjuedo
18 mins ago





Do you really need the word, "American" in the first sentence? The sentence seems correct for immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians, et al., too.

– donjuedo
18 mins ago













@donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

– Steve
4 mins ago





@donjuedo I haven't spoken to many immature Canadians/Europeans/Australians. I dunno how they act in these situations.

– Steve
4 mins ago













@Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

– Steve
1 min ago





@Ister it should, but it won't. If there's an exit interview at your company this manager will get fired over not paying you over time and the like. Managers generally have more to lose too. Given the rest of this toxic manager's stats, 50% of a team you count yourself, the manager won't do anything. The toxic manager really can't do anything without hurting themselves.

– Steve
1 min ago













@Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

– donjuedo
42 secs ago






@Steve, I'm sorry I was not clear. Please drop the term "American" in your answer. It is inflammatory, unnecessary, and not relevant to the OP question or your answer. Thanks.

– donjuedo
42 secs ago


















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